So, looking at the Stance Checks in Patch'd Up, Test of Caution seems kind of unbalanced in terms of Skills.
Increasing your Die pool in any way is counterproductive. Whereas getting a +2 almost guarantees you will not get a full failure. Zen style passes automatically.
Hey, I'm interested in eventually getting this game but I'm mainly waiting for the big update before I get it. Is there any update on that front? I remember being recommended this system in a video I watched and I look forward to reading and running it.
Page 25 of the Patch'd Up PDF under Edges Rework states:
"When you enter a Pit from Forced Movement, however, that push or pull immediately ends, then you take 2 Fall damage. If a Pit is placed directly under you, you take 2 Fall damage. Fall damage cannot be reduced or prevented by any means."
And then page 26 under Armor Rework states:
"Armor is a once per turn, automatic block. The first time each turn that you take damage, if you have Armor, reduce that damage by 3. This can apply to any type of damage, including Fall damage, burning token damage, Super Move damage, or damage dealt by a Trap."
Does this (potentially) conflicting information mean that:
1) The Fall damage from Pits specifically cannot be reduced.
Is there a rough timeline on when the "Patch'd Up" changes will be edited into the main PDF? I'm interested in the game but trying to parse the main book with the separate errata document seems potentially messy.
Thank you. I was looking a little at the PDF after purchasing it but if it's that soon I'll probably just wait to redownload and enjoy the edited version.
Question, I noticed some of the archetype's styles were cut off to where I can only see their names, is that a mistake or an issue with my PDF reader of choice, in which case I use Adobe Acrobat Reader. This info btw I'm bringing up is from the patched up version. Also does blaster form no longer provide a range increase outside of amplify?
Edit: Does Flashy style still provide its passive of combining two rolls together or was that removed?
The Patch'd Up version of the rules only includes changes from the core book. Any styles printed as just their name had no changes, other than gaining the new tags or in a few cases, having their Range adjusted.
So Flashy and Blaster still have all the same Abilities they do in the core book, but the only part of them that changed is their Actions.
Odd question and figured I'd ask while it was still on my mind, I saw the document note that you can make copies you have perform an action you initiate, but does that mean the copy inherits your current range to perform said action, or can a copy only perform that action while within your current range?
For example, if I initiated the "Now You See Me..." ability from Phantom and had a copy range 4 away from me, would that copy actually be able to use the ability? If so, would it be able to do so within range 3 of itself, or just within range 3 of me?
Copies use your Stance's current range. Basically, when you perform an Action through a copy, perform it as if you were standing in the copy's space until the Action is over. You don't actually move to that space, but it makes it easy to visualize how things function.
Question about Wild Form and Ten Thousand Style, when it says add action dice, it shows the number on the die. Is it saying add the die itself meaning you roll those dice again, or does it add the number of that die to your action dice pool?
I recently found out about this game and it sounds super interesting! Is it better to purchase through this site or DTRPG? Also, do we have to manually keep track of what the patch updates change in the corebook, or does it implement in the PDF?
Much appreciated! So if we purchase it now (and aren’t planning on getting a physical copy), will we get an email update of the download link for the new PDF version or something? If so, would you advise buying through itch.io or DTRPG?
Itch will send you an update when the game updates (depending on your settings) and you'll be able to redownload it. I expect DTRPG to do the same, but I hear Itch gives creators more money from the sales
Stepnix was correct on all counts. You'll get the updated PDF for free, you just need to come back to itch or DTRPG to download the update when it comes out. And I do get a bigger cut from itch.io, so if you do not intend to purchase a physical copy, it is better to get your digital copy here.
I am currently updating the game. A new version of the print book will be available once I am done with updates - I'd expect it to be available in September.
How does the Bleeding style interact with multiple health bars? By the strictest interpretation, a solo boss who's reduced to 0 hit points while in Bleeding style would lose immediately, with no regard for remaining health bar, but the other interpretation I can think of, that the ability doesn't activate until you're on your last health bar, means it doesn't benefit a solo boss at all and is proportionally weaker the more health bars the character has.
A solo boss does not benefit from the Bleeding Ability at all, no. Once at zero HP on their last health bar, their side has no remaining units and they lose.
I bought the game on Drivethrough yesterday and i noticed a big problem for me. It seems that the action dice section of the forms uses only images, which makes the product unplayable for a blind gamer such as myself.
can an edit be made in the near future to make theese sections accessible;
First of all; love the game. It's the most engaging combat system I've ever met.
Now the questions: 1. I was reading through the errata and noticed Halcyon style doesn't specify the category of tokens it can remove and can target "someone". Does this mean I can target an enemy and remove their rare tokens?
2. The new Singing Style's ability doesn't specify the range- it just says "all enemies". Given that you've done a lot of errata to add ranges other places this seems odd. Was that deliberate (and means what it says- i.e. "screw everybody on the other team") or an omission?
The combat in this system is, hands down, some of the most mechanically satisfying I have ever seen in a TTRPG. The turn order and protections from turn advantage are actually really nicely done, the flow of combat is far more tactical and less prone to dice swing, and overall it just has a really nice feel and flow in my opinion. The execution is a little rough in some places, though the recent Errata did help plug some of the holes in the original material. If this sounds like it appeals to you, grab this book, even if only for inspiration or an alternate system to play with when some of the group aren't available for your regularly scheduled campaigns.
However, much as I must praise the game for its combat, I do have to give it some criticism.
The formatting of the book is a little bit wonky, and the art is unique to say the least. Those aren't deal breakers for me, but can be jarring if you are coming from systems released by major publishers. It's indie, and it looks like it.
There is no official character sheet. For those playing pen n' paper, my recommendation is to grab a steno book, legal notebook, or other spiral book for tracking character features, stances, etc. For those playing online, there are already a few google sheet-based character sheets. It's a small pet peeve for a TTRPG not to have its own character sheet, but again, not really a deal breaker.
Last, and this one may be a deal-breaker for some, but this game is not really centered on the types of long-form campaigns that more narrative games focus on. There aren't really a ton of rules to govern anything that happens between combat, and their only real impact is to determine whether players start the next combat with an advantage, as usual, or in an ambush. This is perhaps the only thing I really dislike about Panic at the Dojo, but even still, I must recommend it based on the combat rules alone.
Very cool system, I'm eager to get to experience it in action when I get the chance - one question, though: if an ability or action says "heal x", it means healing the actual value of x, not multiplied by heal value, right? For example, the Angel focused and fused abilities, or Dance form's Try and Keep Up.
Great game. Not sure if you've answered this somewhere below, but what happens when actions conflict? For instance -- an enemy has declared an action, but I have a Speed Token and I want to spend it. How do we know who gets to go first? Is it just whoever blurted out their idea first?
Speed tokens during opponents' turns can only be spent at the start of the turn, the end of the turn, or in response to being put over an Edge space. You don't get a chance to spend it during the action phase.
For reactive actions, like the ones granted by Chaos tokens or the Reversal Form, you get the opportunity to use those after the active player has performed an action, and only one reaction per action.
The step by step turn order can be found on page 28 of the PATCH'd UP update pdf.
It dawns on me that this prevents 3-way conflicts, and that the heroes are left to sort out who spends their Speed Tokens in what order among themselves?
I have some questions about the patch'd up Errata You can no longer move allies with grapple/throw, is this to make fatigue harder to get around?
I have concerns about the new Singing style. Singing Zen (7 5 3) give 11 burning tokens to one enemy and 5 burning tokens to each enemy in range. I think this is just the best burning applicator in the book by far. I'm going to have to test it against my players to see if there is a effective counter to this strategy.
Hi! I just ran this system with my friends for the first time yesterday and it was a lot of fun for us all. I just have a small question that came up yesterday:
If I was to spend more than one Power Token (via Power Form) on a move that pushes an enemy back, do they get pushed back more spaces for each Power Token being spent, or do they only get pushed one space total?
The updated PDF will be available for free to anyone who has purchased the game previously.
If you bought a physical copy, my apologies, but those are too expensive to give out for free. You would need to buy a new physical copy once it is available. You can still get the free PDF update.
Hello! I am excited about the updates, I have ran this game a few times in the past. Had a lot of fun,
There is one thing I am still a bit confused about in the book. On page 25, it says "There's two main ways to decide on the terrain of a battlefield. The first is Free-form." but the section never says what the other one is. Although I have always assumed the other options is just that the players don't get to add extra obstacles to the map.
Tested the game with a couple of friends, did a couple of quick fights and erased a Lightweight 3-bar boss in a single action (Ten Thousand Gunkata Style + One-Two Form with 10 power tokens). It was cool and hilarious, exactly the vibe we want out of a game like this, but we were also sitting around with our jaws on the table for a bit.
The power tokens are the thing we're wondering about - I set it up with Training Teacher Style + Song Form, and it seems like Training tokens (or Take Aim from Crosshair) would boost a lot more things in Sing Along than seems intended? To run through it, with all the variables in bold caps:
1+ or 4+ or 6+: Sing Along
Choose ONE ally you can see. Choose ONE: They remove ONE token they hold; they heal; or they gain TWO tokens from your song.
4+: They also choose ONE from the list.
6+: Add a 4 to their Action Pool. They must immediately spend it on an Action.
With just one of Training or Take Aim, you spread the move to two allies, each of them gets two picks from the basic list - and both the token options are buffed too! - and you give both of them a free instant off-turn 5 action. With both a Training token and Take Aim (both of which should stack in either order, because Training a Take Aim would increase the cost and all values of the next action by +2 anyway), you can target three people, who take all three actions on the list twice and then get a 6 action (and if you target yourself, you can also then use the 6 for *another* maxed Sing Along on a single ally). If you roll well, you can do this twice on a turn in Crosshair Song or Training Song, which is what I did to generate 10 tokens for two allies in a single round of prep.
It was incredibly fun and satisfying, but also felt unintentionally powerful? I'm wondering if there's something about it we overlooked or if it's going to get addressed in the errata, or if it's just an explosive payoff for spending a turn (and a good roll, since it costs at least a 3 and a 5 to stack tokens or a 7 for the free action) on fully selfless support for a more aggressive ally.
Edit for context: it did also take specifically a rate-of-fire character to spend those tokens over multiple attacks, and it was a Lightweight 9x3 boss and he had to plan out which attack would happen when to keep her in range and not waste damage, so it wasn't exactly a win button even still, but, again, jaws dropped for a little bit.
Yeah I think this is mostly a good reward for throwing a LOT behind one ally and having two other characters be in Support stances; you have one character who has to be in Training + ? and another who has to have Crosshair Song.
Then, you're spending two actions (most likely Watch Closely and something off the given Form) to hand Crosshair Song a Training Token, and Crosshair Song needs to either be Fused Wardancer, or have a SPECTACULAR roll.
It's 4 actions across two turns-- which allows the enemy forces to respond-- and demands either good rolls, or (for more consistency) a Fused or Frantic Wardancer in Crosshair Song.
Hell to pull off-- it's VERY swingy. At base, it only works 1/3 of the time; a Fused Wardancer Gunkata can do it 3/4 times and a Frantic Wardancer Crosshair Song turn (good GOD) can even then only pull it off 7 times out of 8.
But when you're talking about Fused Wardancer Gunkata and Frantic Wardancer Crosshair Song you're literally building a character to do this, so, like, yeah, I sure hope you can, because this is a character who has spent a Stance and an Archetype to do just this one thing and will likely eat entire enemy turns without real recourse in any weight class that can withstand that kind of power.
ETA: There's ONE other problem with this. Like with other Token removal or discard options, you HAVE to remove that many. This means you can get through the bad token options and be left with the Basic Tokens you want to keep around!
ETA*2: Also, if that Boss had Armor you would not have been able to do that. Note that you can only spend one Power per hit unless you're in Power. in addition, anything that gains Iron off instances of damage (Underdogs, Taunting Style) would have an easier time.
ETA*3: and I completely m issed that it's going to be changed in any case. Whoops!
I bought the book after reading about it on a FB RPG group. Where can I download a character sheet to record all the info for my character ? That would be great to have one
Potential Errata/FAQ Quandary: If a Wardancer takes Forbidden: Iron/Power. And spends a die to gain speed tokens. How would they translate? My assumption: Half become iron, the rest become power, round up for one. (so a 5 would give 3 iron, 2 power) Possibly: round off both (so a 5 would give 3 iron, 3 power) Hope not: They both take the same majority half (5 gives 3 iron, 3 power, 2 speed)
Hello! Discovered this wonderful system recently, and began theorycrafting characters immediately!
I ran into a seeming contradiction between the rules and the advice, and wondered if you could help me with it?
So I was looking at making a Winterblossom fighter, and was considering Frozen Style. The advice there calls out Frozen Dance as a good combination - and thematically that seems great!
But then I read the rules on Grapple and Pull again, and from my read of them Frozen Dance is actually a terrible combo! I can't help but feel I'm likely missing or else misunderstanding something.
So Pull effects (in this case, both the Basic Grapple Action and the Pull added to Free Movement by Dance Form) are described on pg 9 as "each movement must bring them to a space closer to you".
The problem? Frozen Style has a Range of 1! So if someone is in Range, they can't get any closer, so I can't actually Pull them.
Based on the fact that you specifically reccomended Frozen Dance as a good combo, I feel like I must be missing or misunderstanding somewhere. Can you enlighten me? Thanks!
EDIT: Found a comment you made previously where you clarified that a Pull can move someone adjacent to you to another adjacent space, which is great for that part of Dance Form! I'm still confused as to whether the Pull resulting from Free Movement is wasted if I move out of adjacency with someone, however. Do I need to use this "adjacent pull" to keep them next to me for the entire process if I wish to dance my dance of weakness tokens, or can I actually drag them across the map? Thanks again!
You need to remain adjacent to them the entire time for your dance of weakness, yes. It is a little complicated but you can still drag them quite far - you don't have to pull them adjacent to you in the same direction you moved, so the two of you can swap sides as you cross the map together.
So counter attack from Reversal form. Does that mean you teleport to a enemy that attacked you regardless of distance but you have to place yourself within your stance range of them when you do teleport, or does it mean you can only teleport if that enemy is within your range first?
The first thing you said. It doesn't matter where they were when they hit you, it can still be triggered. Then, you teleport to any open space that will place your attacker within your Range
Since you're answering questions, I was wondering: does the Fused Flametongue ability only trigger once per turn, or is it once per turn per enemy? The ability could be read either way, and I'm not quite sure which one is the intent.
Update, I have started my first fight. Not very many turns in yet but I and one other player agree that this is one of the best combat systems we've touched. It's simple but very interactive and fun.
This is such a quick game to set up and play that it's become a big hit, and as a result I've been getting a match in just about every night. I've ran enough fights at this point that my players and I are finding the balance we like, but there are still things we aren't sure about.
In Zen stance. When you gain a new shield and choose to replace your current shield, does it go into reserve, or do you discard it? The level 7 Zen ability gives you a 2 shield, then a 4. Half my players think that means you take the 2 and keep the 4 in reserve, or you willingly give up your 2 to have the 4 active immediately. the other think it means you can replace the 2 with the 4 and put the 2 in reserve.
Are teachers able to spend Inspired tokens on themselves if they hoard them till their next turn?
Do copies replace fog tokens and vice versa? We've been playing it that copies/walls/traps can't normally exist together, but that fog can exist on anything.
This is more of a balance observation with a related question. Vigilance Form is really good. A heal or token drop, a 1+-4+ for weakness tokens, and a 1+-4+ line of sight heal has made it probably the most disruptive form in our group. We've been talking about different ways to tone it down, including limiting the heal to range, having fog block line of sight to friendlies, or making it a smaller heal, like a flat 1 or 2. I was curious if you find it to be that strong in your games, and if so, what you might propose. Or, if maybe there is something obvious we might be missing.
And finally, my second and last balance thought. Wild style is hard to use on bosses. At a glance I thought it would let them sneak in extra turns for healing themselves or spreading around damage. In practice it doesn't trigger extra dice very often, and when it does it can't quite seem to make up the difference in damage, healing, or action economy other forms manage. The group has proposed having bosses gain the bonus dice differently, with 1d6 after their first health bar is gone, and an additional 1d6 after half or more of their health bars are gone, with the bonus die for special tokens remaining unchanged. I'm curious for your thoughts here as well. Do you find solo bosses should avoid Wild form? Do you have a fix you prefer?
If you replace your current shield with a new one while in Zen Form, the replaced shield goes in reserve. Zen Form never discards shields except by breaking them (or using them to pay for an action) or by changing off of Zen Form.
Teachers can inspire any ally, so yes, if they still have the tokens when their turn comes back around, they can use it on themselves.
In the current rules, yes, placing any other obstacle will override a copy or fog in that space. In the upcoming errata, Copies are treated much more like players, and can be on top of Rubble or Fog without issue. I didn't have a note for Fog, but no reason I can't add one - Fog should be allowed on top of Copies, Traps, or Rubble without issue.
Vigilance's Actions are getting a cost increase. I doubt it will stop being strong, but it will be less free.
I do have a fix for Wild Form actually. I found the ability inconsistent in practice, so I've changed two things about it: One, it does something other than give bonus action dice. It's small but useful - at the start of your turn you gain 1 of each Basic token. Two, it has 5 conditions that can be met to give bonus dice, although it can only give +3d6 even if you meet 4 or all 5 of them.
Makes sense thanks for the fast response though i do have another question if i activate follow my lead from my copy can i then follow my own lead as i am an ally?
So quick questions. Do you count as a valid target for your own abilities that target "Ally"? I imagine not since you have the "someone" version on other abilities.
And does Challenge stop you from using abilities that do things to yourself? Like are you unable to use Yell to gain power tokens or any other albitites that affect you yourself but not the enemy. Because I feel like me and my friend group may have massively misunderstood Challenge and made it more powerful than it actually is.
Oh and something else I thought up. Does Mastermind style bypass Challenge since you yourself can not preform actions and instead use your dice to make other people take actions for you?
1: Already answered, but you are your own ally. No benefit to targeting yourself with a pull or a push, but for giving tokens or healing, yes.
2: In the current version of the rules, any action with targets must include your Challenger. So, you can Yell, since Yell has no targets, but you couldn't use Stand Strong to heal yourself, because it does have targets and could target your Challenger.
In the upcoming errata, Challenge tokens' effects are changed to "All damage-dealing actions you perform must include your Challenger as a target", so actions like Stand Strong are unaffected by holding a Challenge token.
3: Yeah, you don't target anyone while in Mastermind style. You just walk around and shout orders. However, if an ally you control has a challenge token, you will need to consider that for the Action you make them do.
2. In the current rules (and it appears this wouldn't be so with future updates) are you able to "Put It Out" to remove a challenge token from yourself, since it doesn't target the enemy? I would think no and am unsure where to confirm this.
It also sounds as if the new erreta wouldn't cause this confusion. Just playing a support, and currently it seems like I can't use Song form properly if challenged and I must go aggro.
Additionally, is there a discord or anywhere else questions can be asked? I am super curious and would love to pick the minds of people who have the authority to rule over the system, or at least politely ask questions.
I'm going to pivot a bit from Aetherbard's question - in the upcoming errata, would you be able to remove Challenge tokens with Put It Out (either on yourself or an ally)? It feels like turning Challenge from a turn of tanking into a one-action tax is stronger than intended, since Challenge tokens can't stack in any way - an action tax is very strong, but still totally different mechanically from what an Angel, Reversal, or Zen stance might want - but at the same time, even in the current version Put It Out would be able to calm an ally down from a Challenge token.
This game looks amazing and I totally wanna give it a try. Question though, I know it says 3-5 players. Would the rules still work for 1 player and 1 DM?
I'm relatively certain the game is balanced for the player side and enemy side to have an equal number of health bars. So, for example, if one player is up against two enemies, the player gets two bars while each enemy gets one. This would also give the player two turns per round.
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So, looking at the Stance Checks in Patch'd Up, Test of Caution seems kind of unbalanced in terms of Skills.
Increasing your Die pool in any way is counterproductive. Whereas getting a +2 almost guarantees you will not get a full failure. Zen style passes automatically.
Is the creator okay? The radio silence is a little concerning.
They're more active on the discord
Hey, I'm interested in eventually getting this game but I'm mainly waiting for the big update before I get it. Is there any update on that front? I remember being recommended this system in a video I watched and I look forward to reading and running it.
I’ve been wondering the exact same thing. Hopefully we get an update soon.
Page 25 of the Patch'd Up PDF under Edges Rework states:
"When you enter a Pit from Forced Movement, however, that push or pull immediately ends, then you take 2 Fall damage. If a Pit is placed directly under you, you take 2 Fall damage. Fall damage cannot be reduced or prevented by any means."
And then page 26 under Armor Rework states:
"Armor is a once per turn, automatic block. The first time each turn that you take damage, if you have Armor, reduce that damage by 3. This can apply to any type of damage, including Fall damage, burning token damage, Super Move damage, or damage dealt by a Trap."
Does this (potentially) conflicting information mean that:
1) The Fall damage from Pits specifically cannot be reduced.
2) Fall damage cannot be reduced.
3) Fall damage cannot be reduced except by Armor.
#3 is the answer, I need to update the Pits description to match the new effect of Armor.
Try reaching out on twitter it maybe the best place
Twitter or the Discord is probably the best way to reach them. I'll post a picture of your comment in Discord.
Sure, delete it. Thanks!
Is there a rough timeline on when the "Patch'd Up" changes will be edited into the main PDF? I'm interested in the game but trying to parse the main book with the separate errata document seems potentially messy.
As of today the current working timeframe is this time next week. This could very well change tho
Thank you. I was looking a little at the PDF after purchasing it but if it's that soon I'll probably just wait to redownload and enjoy the edited version.
Any update on the release?
Question, I noticed some of the archetype's styles were cut off to where I can only see their names, is that a mistake or an issue with my PDF reader of choice, in which case I use Adobe Acrobat Reader. This info btw I'm bringing up is from the patched up version. Also does blaster form no longer provide a range increase outside of amplify?
Edit: Does Flashy style still provide its passive of combining two rolls together or was that removed?
The Patch'd Up version of the rules only includes changes from the core book. Any styles printed as just their name had no changes, other than gaining the new tags or in a few cases, having their Range adjusted.
So Flashy and Blaster still have all the same Abilities they do in the core book, but the only part of them that changed is their Actions.
Odd question and figured I'd ask while it was still on my mind, I saw the document note that you can make copies you have perform an action you initiate, but does that mean the copy inherits your current range to perform said action, or can a copy only perform that action while within your current range?
For example, if I initiated the "Now You See Me..." ability from Phantom and had a copy range 4 away from me, would that copy actually be able to use the ability? If so, would it be able to do so within range 3 of itself, or just within range 3 of me?
Copies use your Stance's current range. Basically, when you perform an Action through a copy, perform it as if you were standing in the copy's space until the Action is over. You don't actually move to that space, but it makes it easy to visualize how things function.
Question about Wild Form and Ten Thousand Style, when it says add action dice, it shows the number on the die. Is it saying add the die itself meaning you roll those dice again, or does it add the number of that die to your action dice pool?
It adds the dice itself, so you will roll that die as part of your action dice
Thank you so much, was just curious.
I recently found out about this game and it sounds super interesting! Is it better to purchase through this site or DTRPG? Also, do we have to manually keep track of what the patch updates change in the corebook, or does it implement in the PDF?
The errata will be added to the core book soon, at the moment they're separate docs though
Much appreciated! So if we purchase it now (and aren’t planning on getting a physical copy), will we get an email update of the download link for the new PDF version or something? If so, would you advise buying through itch.io or DTRPG?
Itch will send you an update when the game updates (depending on your settings) and you'll be able to redownload it. I expect DTRPG to do the same, but I hear Itch gives creators more money from the sales
Stepnix was correct on all counts. You'll get the updated PDF for free, you just need to come back to itch or DTRPG to download the update when it comes out. And I do get a bigger cut from itch.io, so if you do not intend to purchase a physical copy, it is better to get your digital copy here.
I might be stupid but how do we get the patchd up version?
It is in the Demo downloads section.
Hi, uhh, the download button in the Demo section leads to a void(0), so... can't download the file.
It works fine for me? Just a standard left click
I just want to say this idea rocks and I'll be buying the game on my next paycheck
Will there be a Character Sheet available soon?
My group uses this Google Sheet to handle character sheets. Hope it helps.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Er2Fv3VTVh6X4-zIpkXysGof5VqCc37W7c3LF85O...
Hiya! It says the game is available for print through DTRPG, but it only looks like the PDF is available? Any chance a second print run will happen?
I am currently updating the game. A new version of the print book will be available once I am done with updates - I'd expect it to be available in September.
Sounds good!! Absolutely adore this game and its systems BTW ~ Very very excited to own it in print at some point!
How does the Bleeding style interact with multiple health bars? By the strictest interpretation, a solo boss who's reduced to 0 hit points while in Bleeding style would lose immediately, with no regard for remaining health bar, but the other interpretation I can think of, that the ability doesn't activate until you're on your last health bar, means it doesn't benefit a solo boss at all and is proportionally weaker the more health bars the character has.
A solo boss does not benefit from the Bleeding Ability at all, no. Once at zero HP on their last health bar, their side has no remaining units and they lose.
I bought the game on Drivethrough yesterday and i noticed a big problem for me. It seems that the action dice section of the forms uses only images, which makes the product unplayable for a blind gamer such as myself.
can an edit be made in the near future to make theese sections accessible;
Yes, I will make an edit for you. My apologies
First of all; love the game. It's the most engaging combat system I've ever met.
Now the questions:
1. I was reading through the errata and noticed Halcyon style doesn't specify the category of tokens it can remove and can target "someone". Does this mean I can target an enemy and remove their rare tokens?
2. The new Singing Style's ability doesn't specify the range- it just says "all enemies". Given that you've done a lot of errata to add ranges other places this seems odd. Was that deliberate (and means what it says- i.e. "screw everybody on the other team") or an omission?
1: Yes, the higher tiers of Purify can remove rare tokens.
2: Yes, singing style's Ability debuffs everyone on the enemy team, just like Song Form's Ability buffs everyone on your team.
Things to know before you buy:
The combat in this system is, hands down, some of the most mechanically satisfying I have ever seen in a TTRPG. The turn order and protections from turn advantage are actually really nicely done, the flow of combat is far more tactical and less prone to dice swing, and overall it just has a really nice feel and flow in my opinion. The execution is a little rough in some places, though the recent Errata did help plug some of the holes in the original material. If this sounds like it appeals to you, grab this book, even if only for inspiration or an alternate system to play with when some of the group aren't available for your regularly scheduled campaigns.
However, much as I must praise the game for its combat, I do have to give it some criticism.
The formatting of the book is a little bit wonky, and the art is unique to say the least. Those aren't deal breakers for me, but can be jarring if you are coming from systems released by major publishers. It's indie, and it looks like it.
There is no official character sheet. For those playing pen n' paper, my recommendation is to grab a steno book, legal notebook, or other spiral book for tracking character features, stances, etc. For those playing online, there are already a few google sheet-based character sheets. It's a small pet peeve for a TTRPG not to have its own character sheet, but again, not really a deal breaker.
Last, and this one may be a deal-breaker for some, but this game is not really centered on the types of long-form campaigns that more narrative games focus on. There aren't really a ton of rules to govern anything that happens between combat, and their only real impact is to determine whether players start the next combat with an advantage, as usual, or in an ambush. This is perhaps the only thing I really dislike about Panic at the Dojo, but even still, I must recommend it based on the combat rules alone.
Can a Challenged fighter attack Copies of the Challenger?
Very cool system, I'm eager to get to experience it in action when I get the chance - one question, though: if an ability or action says "heal x", it means healing the actual value of x, not multiplied by heal value, right? For example, the Angel focused and fused abilities, or Dance form's Try and Keep Up.
That's correct. "Heal 2" means "ignore the heal value of the fight, this only heals 2 HP"
Great game. Not sure if you've answered this somewhere below, but what happens when actions conflict? For instance -- an enemy has declared an action, but I have a Speed Token and I want to spend it. How do we know who gets to go first? Is it just whoever blurted out their idea first?
Speed tokens during opponents' turns can only be spent at the start of the turn, the end of the turn, or in response to being put over an Edge space. You don't get a chance to spend it during the action phase.
For reactive actions, like the ones granted by Chaos tokens or the Reversal Form, you get the opportunity to use those after the active player has performed an action, and only one reaction per action.
The step by step turn order can be found on page 28 of the PATCH'd UP update pdf.
Thank you!
It dawns on me that this prevents 3-way conflicts, and that the heroes are left to sort out who spends their Speed Tokens in what order among themselves?
Yes, that's right.
I know there is a fan made character sheet going around but is there any plans for making an official character sheet or a vtt add on?
No official plans. The fans making them are better at it than I'd be.
Fantastic system. Veteran DM in 5e, BREAK!!, and Witcher TRPG, and this is probably the best combat system I've run so far.
When will the main PDF be updated to include the rule changes in the Errata? It still shows a Last Edited date of 2021 (on Itch Download page).
I am working on it, expect it to take at least a month though.
Copy that. Thanks for the reply. I'll let my group know.
I have some questions about the patch'd up Errata
You can no longer move allies with grapple/throw, is this to make fatigue harder to get around?
I have concerns about the new Singing style.
Singing Zen (7 5 3) give 11 burning tokens to one enemy and 5 burning tokens to each enemy in range. I think this is just the best burning applicator in the book by far. I'm going to have to test it against my players to see if there is a effective counter to this strategy.
Hi! I just ran this system with my friends for the first time yesterday and it was a lot of fun for us all. I just have a small question that came up yesterday:
If I was to spend more than one Power Token (via Power Form) on a move that pushes an enemy back, do they get pushed back more spaces for each Power Token being spent, or do they only get pushed one space total?
Thanks, and looking forward to the update!
They get pushed back a number of additional spaces equal to the number of Power tokens spent on the attack.
Thank you! Loving the new rules so far!
I made my purchase using drivethrurpg, will I be able to get an updated copy; when the errata comes out?
The updated PDF will be available for free to anyone who has purchased the game previously.
If you bought a physical copy, my apologies, but those are too expensive to give out for free. You would need to buy a new physical copy once it is available. You can still get the free PDF update.
Excellent! Thank you for letting me know.
Will I be able to download it straight from dtrpg? Also when does the update come out
The PDF update is already available for download through DTRPG and here on itch.io.
The updated book will be available at least a month or two from now, the print production pipeline is a bit slow.
hello there how can I know when the errata is going to happen ?
The errata has now happened.
awesome thank you!
Hello! I am excited about the updates, I have ran this game a few times in the past. Had a lot of fun,
There is one thing I am still a bit confused about in the book. On page 25, it says "There's two main ways to decide on the terrain of a battlefield. The first is Free-form." but the section never says what the other one is. Although I have always assumed the other options is just that the players don't get to add extra obstacles to the map.
Oh, yeah sorry the other option is to use a pre-made map, but then I never got around to premaking maps. So. Ignore that
Thank you!
Tested the game with a couple of friends, did a couple of quick fights and erased a Lightweight 3-bar boss in a single action (Ten Thousand Gunkata Style + One-Two Form with 10 power tokens). It was cool and hilarious, exactly the vibe we want out of a game like this, but we were also sitting around with our jaws on the table for a bit.
The power tokens are the thing we're wondering about - I set it up with Training Teacher Style + Song Form, and it seems like Training tokens (or Take Aim from Crosshair) would boost a lot more things in Sing Along than seems intended? To run through it, with all the variables in bold caps:
1+ or 4+ or 6+: Sing Along
Choose ONE ally you can see. Choose ONE: They remove ONE token they hold; they heal; or they gain TWO tokens from your song.
4+: They also choose ONE from the list.
6+: Add a 4 to their Action Pool. They must immediately spend it on an Action.
With just one of Training or Take Aim, you spread the move to two allies, each of them gets two picks from the basic list - and both the token options are buffed too! - and you give both of them a free instant off-turn 5 action. With both a Training token and Take Aim (both of which should stack in either order, because Training a Take Aim would increase the cost and all values of the next action by +2 anyway), you can target three people, who take all three actions on the list twice and then get a 6 action (and if you target yourself, you can also then use the 6 for *another* maxed Sing Along on a single ally). If you roll well, you can do this twice on a turn in Crosshair Song or Training Song, which is what I did to generate 10 tokens for two allies in a single round of prep.
It was incredibly fun and satisfying, but also felt unintentionally powerful? I'm wondering if there's something about it we overlooked or if it's going to get addressed in the errata, or if it's just an explosive payoff for spending a turn (and a good roll, since it costs at least a 3 and a 5 to stack tokens or a 7 for the free action) on fully selfless support for a more aggressive ally.
Edit for context: it did also take specifically a rate-of-fire character to spend those tokens over multiple attacks, and it was a Lightweight 9x3 boss and he had to plan out which attack would happen when to keep her in range and not waste damage, so it wasn't exactly a win button even still, but, again, jaws dropped for a little bit.
It's getting addressed in the errata- it's getting changed to 'an' ally, rather than 'one' ally, IIRC.
Yeah I think this is mostly a good reward for throwing a LOT behind one ally and having two other characters be in Support stances; you have one character who has to be in Training + ? and another who has to have Crosshair Song.
Then, you're spending two actions (most likely Watch Closely and something off the given Form) to hand Crosshair Song a Training Token, and Crosshair Song needs to either be Fused Wardancer, or have a SPECTACULAR roll.
It's 4 actions across two turns-- which allows the enemy forces to respond-- and demands either good rolls, or (for more consistency) a Fused or Frantic Wardancer in Crosshair Song.
Hell to pull off-- it's VERY swingy. At base, it only works 1/3 of the time; a Fused Wardancer Gunkata can do it 3/4 times and a Frantic Wardancer Crosshair Song turn (good GOD) can even then only pull it off 7 times out of 8.
But when you're talking about Fused Wardancer Gunkata and Frantic Wardancer Crosshair Song you're literally building a character to do this, so, like, yeah, I sure hope you can, because this is a character who has spent a Stance and an Archetype to do just this one thing and will likely eat entire enemy turns without real recourse in any weight class that can withstand that kind of power.
ETA: There's ONE other problem with this. Like with other Token removal or discard options, you HAVE to remove that many. This means you can get through the bad token options and be left with the Basic Tokens you want to keep around!
ETA*2: Also, if that Boss had Armor you would not have been able to do that. Note that you can only spend one Power per hit unless you're in Power. in addition, anything that gains Iron off instances of damage (Underdogs, Taunting Style) would have an easier time.
ETA*3: and I completely m issed that it's going to be changed in any case. Whoops!
I bought the book after reading about it on a FB RPG group. Where can I download a character sheet to record all the info for my character ? That would be great to have one
My group uses this one https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xxjPiJPdKsZ-isJxND07FEIoLoWkn0DeaE5PJb1m... been very helpful.
Thanks a lot!
Access is restricted. You gotta set this to Anyone With the Link in the Share settings for us to be able to use it.
Whoops, there we go.
Potential Errata/FAQ Quandary: If a Wardancer takes Forbidden: Iron/Power. And spends a die to gain speed tokens. How would they translate?
My assumption: Half become iron, the rest become power, round up for one. (so a 5 would give 3 iron, 2 power)
Possibly: round off both (so a 5 would give 3 iron, 3 power)
Hope not: They both take the same majority half (5 gives 3 iron, 3 power, 2 speed)
Your assumption is correct, you would gain no Speed tokens and you would round up for only one of them. The "Movement" Action would be anything but.
Hello! Discovered this wonderful system recently, and began theorycrafting characters immediately!
I ran into a seeming contradiction between the rules and the advice, and wondered if you could help me with it?
So I was looking at making a Winterblossom fighter, and was considering Frozen Style. The advice there calls out Frozen Dance as a good combination - and thematically that seems great!
But then I read the rules on Grapple and Pull again, and from my read of them Frozen Dance is actually a terrible combo! I can't help but feel I'm likely missing or else misunderstanding something.
So Pull effects (in this case, both the Basic Grapple Action and the Pull added to Free Movement by Dance Form) are described on pg 9 as "each movement must bring them to a space closer to you".
The problem? Frozen Style has a Range of 1! So if someone is in Range, they can't get any closer, so I can't actually Pull them.
Based on the fact that you specifically reccomended Frozen Dance as a good combo, I feel like I must be missing or misunderstanding somewhere. Can you enlighten me? Thanks!
EDIT: Found a comment you made previously where you clarified that a Pull can move someone adjacent to you to another adjacent space, which is great for that part of Dance Form! I'm still confused as to whether the Pull resulting from Free Movement is wasted if I move out of adjacency with someone, however. Do I need to use this "adjacent pull" to keep them next to me for the entire process if I wish to dance my dance of weakness tokens, or can I actually drag them across the map? Thanks again!
You need to remain adjacent to them the entire time for your dance of weakness, yes. It is a little complicated but you can still drag them quite far - you don't have to pull them adjacent to you in the same direction you moved, so the two of you can swap sides as you cross the map together.
Hello! First, amazing project, my group been loving reading it and we gonna soon play a one shot.
Second!
Are you thinking in releasing an official character sheet? Be online or not, as fan-made goes https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xxjPiJPdKsZ-isJxND07FEIoLoWkn0DeaE5PJb1m... this one is what my group found. What are your thoughts on it?
There is now a fan-run Panic at the Dojo discord server, for anyone interested: https://discord.gg/zQfQUhAM6u
So counter attack from Reversal form. Does that mean you teleport to a enemy that attacked you regardless of distance but you have to place yourself within your stance range of them when you do teleport, or does it mean you can only teleport if that enemy is within your range first?
The first thing you said. It doesn't matter where they were when they hit you, it can still be triggered. Then, you teleport to any open space that will place your attacker within your Range
thanks again.
Since you're answering questions, I was wondering: does the Fused Flametongue ability only trigger once per turn, or is it once per turn per enemy? The ability could be read either way, and I'm not quite sure which one is the intent.
Once per turn, no matter how many enemies you hit with it.
Update, I have started my first fight.
Not very many turns in yet but I and one other player agree that this is one of the best combat systems we've touched.
It's simple but very interactive and fun.
I'm back with more questions!
This is such a quick game to set up and play that it's become a big hit, and as a result I've been getting a match in just about every night. I've ran enough fights at this point that my players and I are finding the balance we like, but there are still things we aren't sure about.
In Zen stance. When you gain a new shield and choose to replace your current shield, does it go into reserve, or do you discard it? The level 7 Zen ability gives you a 2 shield, then a 4. Half my players think that means you take the 2 and keep the 4 in reserve, or you willingly give up your 2 to have the 4 active immediately. the other think it means you can replace the 2 with the 4 and put the 2 in reserve.
Are teachers able to spend Inspired tokens on themselves if they hoard them till their next turn?
Do copies replace fog tokens and vice versa? We've been playing it that copies/walls/traps can't normally exist together, but that fog can exist on anything.
This is more of a balance observation with a related question. Vigilance Form is really good. A heal or token drop, a 1+-4+ for weakness tokens, and a 1+-4+ line of sight heal has made it probably the most disruptive form in our group. We've been talking about different ways to tone it down, including limiting the heal to range, having fog block line of sight to friendlies, or making it a smaller heal, like a flat 1 or 2. I was curious if you find it to be that strong in your games, and if so, what you might propose. Or, if maybe there is something obvious we might be missing.
And finally, my second and last balance thought. Wild style is hard to use on bosses. At a glance I thought it would let them sneak in extra turns for healing themselves or spreading around damage. In practice it doesn't trigger extra dice very often, and when it does it can't quite seem to make up the difference in damage, healing, or action economy other forms manage. The group has proposed having bosses gain the bonus dice differently, with 1d6 after their first health bar is gone, and an additional 1d6 after half or more of their health bars are gone, with the bonus die for special tokens remaining unchanged. I'm curious for your thoughts here as well. Do you find solo bosses should avoid Wild form? Do you have a fix you prefer?
Looking forward to the Erata, and happy battling.
If you replace your current shield with a new one while in Zen Form, the replaced shield goes in reserve. Zen Form never discards shields except by breaking them (or using them to pay for an action) or by changing off of Zen Form.
Teachers can inspire any ally, so yes, if they still have the tokens when their turn comes back around, they can use it on themselves.
In the current rules, yes, placing any other obstacle will override a copy or fog in that space. In the upcoming errata, Copies are treated much more like players, and can be on top of Rubble or Fog without issue. I didn't have a note for Fog, but no reason I can't add one - Fog should be allowed on top of Copies, Traps, or Rubble without issue.
Vigilance's Actions are getting a cost increase. I doubt it will stop being strong, but it will be less free.
I do have a fix for Wild Form actually. I found the ability inconsistent in practice, so I've changed two things about it: One, it does something other than give bonus action dice. It's small but useful - at the start of your turn you gain 1 of each Basic token. Two, it has 5 conditions that can be met to give bonus dice, although it can only give +3d6 even if you meet 4 or all 5 of them.
Thanks again for the quick answers. We have another game tonight, so these will be put to good use.
In the new errata are copies considered allies?
No, copies are not allies. They cannot be healed or hold tokens, so most of what you'd want to do with allies doesn't work anyway.
Makes sense thanks for the fast response though i do have another question if i activate follow my lead from my copy can i then follow my own lead as i am an ally?
So quick questions. Do you count as a valid target for your own abilities that target "Ally"? I imagine not since you have the "someone" version on other abilities.
And does Challenge stop you from using abilities that do things to yourself? Like are you unable to use Yell to gain power tokens or any other albitites that affect you yourself but not the enemy. Because I feel like me and my friend group may have massively misunderstood Challenge and made it more powerful than it actually is.
Oh and something else I thought up. Does Mastermind style bypass Challenge since you yourself can not preform actions and instead use your dice to make other people take actions for you?
In the description for Song Form it mentions that you always count as your own ally
ah, that helps with that part. Thanks.
1: Already answered, but you are your own ally. No benefit to targeting yourself with a pull or a push, but for giving tokens or healing, yes.
2: In the current version of the rules, any action with targets must include your Challenger. So, you can Yell, since Yell has no targets, but you couldn't use Stand Strong to heal yourself, because it does have targets and could target your Challenger.
In the upcoming errata, Challenge tokens' effects are changed to "All damage-dealing actions you perform must include your Challenger as a target", so actions like Stand Strong are unaffected by holding a Challenge token.
3: Yeah, you don't target anyone while in Mastermind style. You just walk around and shout orders. However, if an ally you control has a challenge token, you will need to consider that for the Action you make them do.
thanks, that helps a lot.
2. In the current rules (and it appears this wouldn't be so with future updates) are you able to "Put It Out" to remove a challenge token from yourself, since it doesn't target the enemy? I would think no and am unsure where to confirm this.
It also sounds as if the new erreta wouldn't cause this confusion. Just playing a support, and currently it seems like I can't use Song form properly if challenged and I must go aggro.
Additionally, is there a discord or anywhere else questions can be asked? I am super curious and would love to pick the minds of people who have the authority to rule over the system, or at least politely ask questions.
I'm going to pivot a bit from Aetherbard's question - in the upcoming errata, would you be able to remove Challenge tokens with Put It Out (either on yourself or an ally)? It feels like turning Challenge from a turn of tanking into a one-action tax is stronger than intended, since Challenge tokens can't stack in any way - an action tax is very strong, but still totally different mechanically from what an Angel, Reversal, or Zen stance might want - but at the same time, even in the current version Put It Out would be able to calm an ally down from a Challenge token.
This game looks amazing and I totally wanna give it a try. Question though, I know it says 3-5 players. Would the rules still work for 1 player and 1 DM?
Yes, absolutely. Give the one player multiple health bars so their character can stand up equal to the threat you throw their way.
ooh, okay. So like a 2:1 ratio would work. like, 2 health bars per 'opponent' ?
I'm relatively certain the game is balanced for the player side and enemy side to have an equal number of health bars. So, for example, if one player is up against two enemies, the player gets two bars while each enemy gets one. This would also give the player two turns per round.