The numbers you hold would empty at the end of the turn, and you change stance at the start of the turn. So, any spare numbers from Reversal Form will linger on to be used in your next Stance. They are kept.
This game is super cool, and i'm really excited to run it with my group. I've got a few questions about stuff tho before i start, i dont wanna make any big mistakes.
Do chaos tokens need to be used on skills that equal exactly 4? if so, why is Ogre the odd demon out with no guaranteed way to use their chaos token?
Also, with the Bomb enemy type, it's listed that they're extremely dangerous, but I don't see how apply pressure is that strong of a blow-up move, the 1 weakness tokens the bombs apply at the start of their turns would go away the second the players connect with a hit right? Does the gm just need to hope the players mess up and stock themselves up with iron and power tokens?
Chaos tokens function as a 4 in your dice pool, so they can still be used for 1+, 2+, and 3+ actions, too, not just 4+. Ogre is intended to use this 4 on a Throw or Grapple, but can also use it on Watch Your Step just fine.
The Bomb's Reversal Form lets them take their Actions at any time. If a player in range EVER builds up tokens to do something, like a bunch of Speed tokens to run around, a bunch of Iron to block with, or a bunch of Power for a deadly crush, a Bomb can instantly punish them with an explosive Apply Pressure.
Alternatively, pair the bomb alongside a Flametongue or other Winter stance to really shove tokens on everyone for you. They're a Stooge, they are not meant to be used by themselves.
I've been having a lot of fun playing this game. Great job on this, it really is very cool. Below are some of the questions we've had at the table that we weren't quite able to suss out on our own:
The rules for traps contradict one another, with one version saying trap damage is triggered at the start of every turn, and another that it triggers at the end. Which should we use? If the former, would it happen before you pick your new stance?
Does armor apply to trap damage? If so does it apply to both instances of stepping into a trap, and lingering on a trap? Can Iron Tokens be spent on trap damage? There is a note about this under Volcanic, but I can't tell if that's a specific edge case or not.
There's a note under Puppet's Style about being able to spend actions to gain speed tokens if you are walked off of an edge at the start of your turn. Is that a special exception to how Puppet's Style works, or a more general rule that you can always spend actions on your turn to gain speed tokens and avoid falls? If the latter, does that mean someone in a Patient/Reversal stance can do the same off turn with their one action? And in a related question, could you use an action to save someone else from going over an edge with a pull mechanic if you have an action handy? The former seems like it might be specific to Puppet's, but the latter we've been back and forth about in my group.
When a character with Wild Form is Taken Out, do they get their extra dice while rolling up numbers for another player using the Heroic Spirit rule? Under Judgment Style it states that abilities turn off while unconscious, so we were unsure.
Can Volcanic Dancer generate a bunch of speed tokens, then just zoom across the field creating a line of fire behind them and dragging a person through it for tons of trap damage? We ruled yes, but this one also brought up the question of whether armor should protect universally from trap damage. We had been playing that it didn't up until then, when Volcanic Dancer was turning numbers on the die into 1 to 1 speed tokens, that were then 1 to 1 damage.
(Edited to add one more)
Trickster style allows you to spend any basic tokens as iron tokens. Does that include for paying the token cost of abilities, or only for reducing damage? Does the focused version of the Trickster ability let you spend tokens like Burning and Weak to do the same?
1: Trap damage is supposed to be End of Turn or when you are moved into it. I will try to find and remove wherever it states Start of Turn instead.
2: Armor blocks 1 damage from all damage sources, including Traps. Iron tokens can be spent on any damage source, up to 2 tokens per source, so yes they can reduce Trap damage.
3: It is a general rule that if you have Speed tokens, you can spend them to escape an Edge you are moved onto. It is a specific note in Puppet Style because Puppet Shadow and Puppet Reversal are one of the few ways to move someone off an edge at the start of their own turn, before they can take any Actions. So, I added the clause that they can immediately spend an action die to use the Basic Action Movement to gain the Speed tokens needed to escape, because otherwise this is an extremely cheesy way to get a ringout. lt happens after they roll their action dice and after they had missed the chance to pass them off with Heroic Spirit, but before they could spend them to do anything, so it was a turn skip combo.
4: Yes, Wild Form is excellent for passing along Heroic Spirit for this reason. Abilities you apply to OTHERS deactivate while you are Taken Out, but still apply to yourself - this is how Vigilance Form can wake you back up from zero HP.
5: Volcanic Dance can indeed deal a ton of damage by dragging someone behind you, although there are two important things to note: first, Iron tokens can stop any forced movement, even Dance's pull, and second, Traps can only deal damage once per turn, so you need to only drag them through new Traps each time. Also, Armor negates this strategy entirely, as mentioned above.
6: The Trickster abilities can be used to pay for Iron token actions, yes. And yes , a Focused Trickster can spend Burning or Weakness tokens to block attacks or to pay for Iron token actions.
Dance form seems odd. It allows you to pull people 1 space if they are in range, does that mean you can pull adjacent targets into another adjacent space or does this ability only work if you have range of at least 2? Frozen style has range 1, bit has a tip to pair with dance to grapple enemies to you. Grapple targets someone in range and the rules for pulling states "... each space must be closer to you than the previous." so grappling/pulling is impossible at range 1.
Oh, this is good to know! I built a character with Frozen Dance, but I was under the impression the idea was that you could interrupt each step of the Pull using Free Movement to effectively drag the target behind you. This interpretation makes a lot more sense, though.
That's the one- when I first read through the book, I used that page for reference and missed the outside-archetype Style until it was pointed out to me elsewhere.
Hi! I was prepping for a test game of this with some folks who are interested in trying out PATD and as I was looking through the premade bosses I had a question. Where is the nonstandard range on Hollow Queen's Vampire Drill Stance coming from? As far as I can tell, Vampire style is range 1 and One-Two form doesn't seem to change range at all. Is there some other source that's moving that from range 1 to range 2-5 that I'm missing?
Does Armor stack? Iron form has different rules for iron token. It says you can reduce movement by 1 per token, and doesn't state the 2 token limit per hit.
Some actions do not specify "With in range" such as Irons Contain Pulling choice and Rally's group up. These actions almost imply that they would effect targets you can see, as Rally doesnt work well without control and Iron can't pull unless it has greater than range one. However under Target rules it states "Targets must be within Range, unless stated otherwise."
Armor does not stack, you either have it or you do not.
Iron Tokens reduce both damage and forced movement, and they have the 2 token limit per hit. If the reminder text under Iron Form differs from that, use these values instead, and I'll fix it in the patch notes.
That is an oversight, both of those examples should be "you can see"
No, Stooges are exceptionally vulnerable to area attacks. Each Stooge is a valid target, so if you hit 3 with a shockwave, they lose 3 HP from their shared health bar.
ayo, just came across this thanks to the sugarpunch video. can't wait to buy it but in the mean time I've been working on a TTS mod for me and my friends to play. I really hope this game blows up!!!
Part of me is curious about Focused Phantom or the Teacher Elder style. Do they still have access to all of the other stances when there are more than three stances? (I admit I am foolishly trying to prepare the character sheets I am building for Foundry for material that is still in development. I take full responsibility for this hubris)
hello there, just like everyone else I came from SugerPunch video. I gonna get the game soon but I have a question. I know from other reviews there isn't a character advancement per say. but is there any way I could hack some kind advancement system into the game?
If you scroll down a bit, there is a post from liberigothica that includes an image that has a preliminary advancement system in the works. The message is from a year ago so you might have to scroll for a little bit.
I had a question concerning frantic wardancer with the wild style. I have thought of a few ways that wild style using two forms might work, but I wanted confirmation (and if it is something else entirely, please let me know). 1. You still only pick three forms at character creation, but when you use wild style, you use two of them. 2. You pick four forms at character creation, but two of them are paired and always used with wild style. 3. You pick four forms at character creation, and you can chose any two when you are using wild style.
The version in the book uses option 1, but I do have that in the upcoming errata as:
When you pick Forbidden Style on a Frantic character, choose one Form. That Form is always attached to Forbidden Style, along with a second Form chosen when you make your stance during your turn.
Thank you! I am working on building a functional character sheet in Foundry for some friends and I to use for online sessions (drop down menus for selecting things, fields auto populating with relevent info, etc). I am being meticulous and trying to include all of the niche cases like Phantom and Forbidden style.
I hope to be able to share the sheets on Foundry once I am done for others to use.
This is an awesome game, but one infinite I spotted was Frantic Phantom, One-Two maybe Blaster form, Brawling Style, and Flamethrower from Incinerator. Only works if they're against a wall, but still. Would appreciate if it was in the Errata.
Thank you for letting me know! This is the second (possibly third) infinite that's been found with Frantic Phantom, actually, so I already had an errata for it:
Once during this turn, you can use any Unique Action you know, from among all your Styles and Forms. You must still pay its Cost.
Your Unique Actions have their cost reduced by 1 (to a minimum of 1+ or 2 tokens) during this turn.
As so many have said before me: This game is incredible! As a Magic player, I get the same feeling I get from deck building, as a TTRPG! Hosting games soon =)
To add to the Infinite topic: Fused Phantom + Elder Style + Song Form can Sing Along to give itself a 4 Action Die, and loop the song for infinite Basic Tokens for themselves and their team.
Just like in MtG, cost reductions can be abused, haha!
Hi, this game looks awesome (discovered via Sugarpunch video)! Do you intend to release an errata-ed/updated version? If I buy the game now, and there's an update in the future, do I get the update for free or do I have to buy again the updated version?
Hi, I was wondering if there was a discord or forum or something to ask questions about the system. A friend and I tried a quick sample fight, and his character was using the Focused Phantom Archetype. With it he had a Vortex Power stance and a Puppet Control stance, and it seems like you can, on turn 1, simply set up a Black Hole and instantly ring out someone by using Pull the Strings to move them into the "Edge" created by Black Hole. Is this correct or does the opponent get a turn to be allowed to use Speed tokens to get out of the Black Hole?
In a 1v1 scenario, I'd give both sides the Big Boss Comeback rule, regardless of whether they're actual Bosses or players, in which case they are removed from play temporarily, but not Taken Out.
In a 2v2 scenario and above, the target is immediately dunked into the Edge and Taken Out, but their allies may Rescue them to get them out on the following player turn, benefit from Heroic Spirit so their turn isn't wasted, etc.
I haven't played much with Edge-based styles, so I can't tell you more.
No, the rules are incredibly light on the roleplaying side; so it would be relatively easy to run solod brawler matches, though you'd need to create a deck or tactical rules for the goons you brawl against. Elsewise it'll feel like you're playing training mode in a tournament fighter.
Saw the youtuber SugarPunch talk about this, and half way in I was sold. This system just seemed way to perfect to not get, i'll be running it before too long with friends of mine.
Given the games general lack of artwork I went for a paperback, hope you're getting fun out of it - my houserule: for Combat - Have a 'turn zero' where in initiative order players add their characters to the grid and choose an opening stance. I think of it like the opening footsies in capcom fighters where players can move but not attack during "ROUND...1..."
Yo! Glad to see the game getting more attention (and looking forwards to the errata pass!).
Our group had a couple of assorted rule questions and comments after play- we made spot calls as needed, but we wanted to raise them as concerns/questions for errata;
1. Question about whether 0 damage counts as damage (answered below).
2. Can you spend any number of iron tokens on one hit (suggested by Armored Style, page 69), or just 1-2 (Glossary, page 280)?
3. How does 'priority' work? If someone wants to take an action during someone else's turn (ex. a token action), can they take as many token actions as they like before that person can take a Simple Action or use Free Movement? Can the person who's turn it is interrupt with their own token action? We generally settled on 'one side has a chance to take an action, then the other side has a chance to take an action'.
4. If a Copy moves into a space with an obstacle (particularly a Trap) using movement, what happens? Do they just coexist?
5. How do actions with an X in their cost interact with cost reduction (Elder, Phantom)? Can we treat them as a 'tiered action' with effectively infinite tiers (one for each possible die roll? Edit: Looked at Waiting Game- I'm going to guess they aren't affected by cost reduction, lol
6. This is a really goofy edge case, but a player actually did this- if someone takes Forbidden Power/Iron can they just not move? Is it split 50%/25%/25%? Our GM ruled that every 2 Speed Tokens effectively generated 1 Power and 1 Iron and 1 Speed (they were quite strong in combat, but it felt pretty fair overall- we had a strong party)
7. Play feedback- Necromancer making copies anywhere in line of sight felt like it could have very easily been overwhelming in combination with a mobile foe due to giving it effectively infinite range- the damage was low impact compared to the ability of the Boss to summon a copy at the start of their turn and then menace us at long range 'for free'. This might be working as intended, but it doesn't feel like the horde playstyle suggested by Necromancer.
8. When a character has a Copy take an action, my understanding is that this means 'you are taking the action, but from the position of the Copy', e.g. the player could, for example, spend Power tokens on behalf of the Copy, or discard their Challenge token if the Copy's action dealt damage to your Challenge target- is this correct?
9. Can you hit a single Mook foe multiple times with stuff like a 3+ Shockwave or Whirlwind if they have multiple bodes in range?
10. Play feedback- Challenge tokens are crazy impactful, and can virtually shut down Song Warriors, which may be completely unable to break through defensive walls or even get in range quickly. Fun, but felt on the edge of being an OP mechanic, with certain builds and situations making it nearly impossible to take any action- when everyone's challenged by one Bring It On!, nobody can even Put It Out! to clear a challenge.
Hello! Picked up Panic at the Dojo after hearing about it via, of course, OSP. Glad to have found your work.
It seems right up my alley, and well-designed: lots of opportunity for interesting decisionmaking in fights and while building a character; and a clean and clear approach to framing those fights. Almost feels like a board game, especially with how symmetrically fights are designed. Several of my friends are also interested, so I may actually get to run the game!
So, caveat that I've read through but not played it yet, I have some questions of intent/clarification:
1. Song Form's details says that you are always your own ally; does this hold everywhere? e.g. can a Teacher can use Inspired tokens and '3+: Watch Closely' on themselves?
2. When Phantom or Elder Style reduces the cost of an action, does that include reducing the cost of gates beyond the first (e.g. would Sing Along be reduced from '1+ or 4+ or 6+' to '1+ or 3+ or 5+'?
3. When you Sing Along without being in Song Form (e.g. via Focused Phantom or Elder Style), you don't have a song token type selected. Is the intent that you simply can't pick the 'gain 2 tokens' mode, or something else?
4. Are Chaos tokens intended to be usable for any action (i.e. as an action pool '4'), or specifically for actions with a cost or gate of exactly '4+' (and no lower)?
5. If something like a Chaos token ("used exclusively by the X") is stolen (e.g. via Syphon Style's '2+ or 6+: Power Converter'), can the recipient use it for its native function?
6. Can a Teacher use multiple Inspired tokens in the same turn?
There's also a few things I've spotted that may be infinite loops; either I've misread something, or they would be good targets for errata:
- Fused or Frantic Phantom + Song Form + Elder Style
If Phantom and Elder Style's cost reductions stack, that would mean the free 4 action from Sing Along would be enough to meet the 6+ gate of another Sing Along, repeating the process and accumulating resources.
- Chaos token + Motivating Style's '4+ You Can Do It!'
If you copy a chaos token, you can use You Can Do It again by expending that chaos token, healing/moving/etc. as you repeat the process. If you can't target yourself, this can still be done with two characters that are fused Demon/Teachers. Inspired tokens could work similarly, but are less egregious since it isn't guaranteed.
- Frantic Phantom + Blaster Form + Vampire Style, using Flare
Distracting Style's '1+ or 2 basic tokens: Flare' can give two enemies a weakness token while using Blaster Form; if you're also using Vampire Style, that would give you two power tokens if I'm reading correctly, which can repeat the process to give those enemies an unlimited number of weakness tokens.
I do really love this system, already; that's why I'm engaging with it so much. Thank you for making it :)
While not an infinite exactly, Brawling Zen is tremendously difficult to take down except by specific approaches.
When your shield is broken by damage from a foe, you gain one Power token from Brawling, then Zen deals 1 damage back to them. If you don't spend Power tokens on this hit, you gain a second Power token, meaning you can immediately put up a new shield with Tough It Out, arguably before the next damage action comes in.
Traps, Crush, and Armor/Iron tokens can counter this to some extent, but it's pretty difficult to break otherwise.
With a bit of setup (an ally with Dance, the Found an Opening bonus, or access to Chaos tokens), a Frantic Phantom with access to Patient style can gain access to Waiting Game outside their turn without being restricted by Patient's 'one action per turn' limit, letting them take it an unlimited number of times before cashing it out as one big infinite-power action (useful for, ex. Movement to generate infinite Speed for some sort of token action).
Edit: Missed that shield damage does overflow to HP! Whoops!
Brawling Zen can rebuild its Shields as they break. While inactive Shields don't normally become active until the end of the turn, you can use Tough It Out after your active Shield breaks to immediately have a new active Shield.
So, asking for clarification, does the 'default bonus' mean that everyone in the team gets +2 max HP, and this can be replaced with only one person getting one of the other bonuses?
I like it! Reads as sensible and appropriately simple and elegant.
First things that jump to mind:
Focused Phantoms get a *lot* of options when they get a fused archetype; including Waiting Game, which breaks when you can get it without the restrictions imposed by Patient Style, Elder Style, or Frantic Phantom.
Focused or Frantic Phantoms will generally scale extremely well with extra stances.
Frantic heroes' expanding combinatorial versatility is offset by not getting as many archetype abilities at once, which I find very elegant.
A lot of potent combos using the extra archetype (e.g. Focused Punk + Fused Winterblossom) are things that a cooperating party would already be able to do, which helps control the scope of things.
Does 0 damage count as damage? One-Two saying you can use it to clear 6 Weakness tokens suggests yes, but Knockdown Style suggests that reducing damage to 0 with Armor and Iron means it doesn't count as damage.
0 damage does not count as "damage," no. One-Two is going to have a written in exception in the errata I am working on, something like: "When you deal damage to an enemy with an Action, hit them again for 1 more damage. Even if the initial damage is reduced to zero by Armor, Iron tokens, or Weakness tokens, you still get this extra 1-damage hit."
My play group is starting to get into the game, and there is a weird rule I cant wrap my brain around. If you are Taken out, do you still get to change stances when it comes time for your heroic spirit turn? It seems weird that you could swap into bleeding/ Zombie and just negate threat by damage that way.
Even more so when something like Angel/ Cavalry doesn't have access to that .
Is there some kind of vulnerability I am not seeing here?
Yes, you do get to change stances (second paragraph, page 31). Of note is that the Vigilance stance heals itself at the start of its turn, meaning that all archetypes can spec into the ability to stand themself back up.
A special note for Angel- as mentioned on page 61, the Angel Ability lets them get back up even when damaged, since it heals them.
The primary counter, as I see it, is to avoid focusing damage on foes who will just regenerate off your damage, or by 'wasting' their healing by only dealing small amounts of damage to them - you win by getting everyone to 0 HP, in whichever order that involves.
I ran a session today, and I had a lot of trouble with Stooges- mainly, how start-of-turn effects work with them, and how tokens are shared- I had a group of Zombies and a The Light (angel/song warrior); I couldn't tell whether the Zombies each generated Iron tokens from their build, gained one token for one of them, etc. A similar question came up for The Light's start-of-turn ability to grant tokens to all allies at once.
Stooges hold tokens as a single unit. An effect that gives 1 Iron token to all allies would only give one Iron token to each separate group of Zombies. They have just the one token pile and any Zombie in the unit may spend tokens from that pile.
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In Reversal Form, If you still have actions at the start of your turn and you switch stances, are those actions kept or lost?
The numbers you hold would empty at the end of the turn, and you change stance at the start of the turn. So, any spare numbers from Reversal Form will linger on to be used in your next Stance. They are kept.
This game is super cool, and i'm really excited to run it with my group. I've got a few questions about stuff tho before i start, i dont wanna make any big mistakes.
Do chaos tokens need to be used on skills that equal exactly 4? if so, why is Ogre the odd demon out with no guaranteed way to use their chaos token?
Also, with the Bomb enemy type, it's listed that they're extremely dangerous, but I don't see how apply pressure is that strong of a blow-up move, the 1 weakness tokens the bombs apply at the start of their turns would go away the second the players connect with a hit right? Does the gm just need to hope the players mess up and stock themselves up with iron and power tokens?
Chaos tokens function as a 4 in your dice pool, so they can still be used for 1+, 2+, and 3+ actions, too, not just 4+. Ogre is intended to use this 4 on a Throw or Grapple, but can also use it on Watch Your Step just fine.
The Bomb's Reversal Form lets them take their Actions at any time. If a player in range EVER builds up tokens to do something, like a bunch of Speed tokens to run around, a bunch of Iron to block with, or a bunch of Power for a deadly crush, a Bomb can instantly punish them with an explosive Apply Pressure.
Alternatively, pair the bomb alongside a Flametongue or other Winter stance to really shove tokens on everyone for you. They're a Stooge, they are not meant to be used by themselves.
I've been having a lot of fun playing this game. Great job on this, it really is very cool. Below are some of the questions we've had at the table that we weren't quite able to suss out on our own:
The rules for traps contradict one another, with one version saying trap damage is triggered at the start of every turn, and another that it triggers at the end. Which should we use? If the former, would it happen before you pick your new stance?
Does armor apply to trap damage? If so does it apply to both instances of stepping into a trap, and lingering on a trap? Can Iron Tokens be spent on trap damage? There is a note about this under Volcanic, but I can't tell if that's a specific edge case or not.
There's a note under Puppet's Style about being able to spend actions to gain speed tokens if you are walked off of an edge at the start of your turn. Is that a special exception to how Puppet's Style works, or a more general rule that you can always spend actions on your turn to gain speed tokens and avoid falls? If the latter, does that mean someone in a Patient/Reversal stance can do the same off turn with their one action? And in a related question, could you use an action to save someone else from going over an edge with a pull mechanic if you have an action handy? The former seems like it might be specific to Puppet's, but the latter we've been back and forth about in my group.
When a character with Wild Form is Taken Out, do they get their extra dice while rolling up numbers for another player using the Heroic Spirit rule? Under Judgment Style it states that abilities turn off while unconscious, so we were unsure.
Can Volcanic Dancer generate a bunch of speed tokens, then just zoom across the field creating a line of fire behind them and dragging a person through it for tons of trap damage? We ruled yes, but this one also brought up the question of whether armor should protect universally from trap damage. We had been playing that it didn't up until then, when Volcanic Dancer was turning numbers on the die into 1 to 1 speed tokens, that were then 1 to 1 damage.
(Edited to add one more)
Trickster style allows you to spend any basic tokens as iron tokens. Does that include for paying the token cost of abilities, or only for reducing damage? Does the focused version of the Trickster ability let you spend tokens like Burning and Weak to do the same?
1: Trap damage is supposed to be End of Turn or when you are moved into it. I will try to find and remove wherever it states Start of Turn instead.
2: Armor blocks 1 damage from all damage sources, including Traps. Iron tokens can be spent on any damage source, up to 2 tokens per source, so yes they can reduce Trap damage.
3: It is a general rule that if you have Speed tokens, you can spend them to escape an Edge you are moved onto. It is a specific note in Puppet Style because Puppet Shadow and Puppet Reversal are one of the few ways to move someone off an edge at the start of their own turn, before they can take any Actions. So, I added the clause that they can immediately spend an action die to use the Basic Action Movement to gain the Speed tokens needed to escape, because otherwise this is an extremely cheesy way to get a ringout. lt happens after they roll their action dice and after they had missed the chance to pass them off with Heroic Spirit, but before they could spend them to do anything, so it was a turn skip combo.
4: Yes, Wild Form is excellent for passing along Heroic Spirit for this reason. Abilities you apply to OTHERS deactivate while you are Taken Out, but still apply to yourself - this is how Vigilance Form can wake you back up from zero HP.
5: Volcanic Dance can indeed deal a ton of damage by dragging someone behind you, although there are two important things to note: first, Iron tokens can stop any forced movement, even Dance's pull, and second, Traps can only deal damage once per turn, so you need to only drag them through new Traps each time. Also, Armor negates this strategy entirely, as mentioned above.
6: The Trickster abilities can be used to pay for Iron token actions, yes. And yes , a Focused Trickster can spend Burning or Weakness tokens to block attacks or to pay for Iron token actions.
Thanks a ton, you rock.
Dance form seems odd. It allows you to pull people 1 space if they are in range, does that mean you can pull adjacent targets into another adjacent space or does this ability only work if you have range of at least 2?
Frozen style has range 1, bit has a tip to pair with dance to grapple enemies to you. Grapple targets someone in range and the rules for pulling states "... each space must be closer to you than the previous." so grappling/pulling is impossible at range 1.
You can pull adjacent targets into another adjacent space.
Grapple is being fixed in the errata to target one enemy within X spaces, and pulls them up to 3 spaces.
Oh, this is good to know! I built a character with Frozen Dance, but I was under the impression the idea was that you could interrupt each step of the Pull using Free Movement to effectively drag the target behind you. This interpretation makes a lot more sense, though.
Mistake on Page 121:
"Frantic Heroes are made by picking three Archetypes, and taking one Style from each."
Where is the mistake? That is correct.
Unless you mean how one of the Styles can be from outside your Archetypes, which is still true.
That's the one- when I first read through the book, I used that page for reference and missed the outside-archetype Style until it was pointed out to me elsewhere.
i finally caved and bought the PDF
i am tempted to try and design a character sheet and put it and possibly the pdf with permission onto tabletop simulator
There's a very decent Google Sheets character sheet that I've used to run my games. May be a useful starting point.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Gi9W5akg_14MGLne_LIWg2KVeO8keRvxMuVfWQ7l...
Hi! I was prepping for a test game of this with some folks who are interested in trying out PATD and as I was looking through the premade bosses I had a question. Where is the nonstandard range on Hollow Queen's Vampire Drill Stance coming from? As far as I can tell, Vampire style is range 1 and One-Two form doesn't seem to change range at all. Is there some other source that's moving that from range 1 to range 2-5 that I'm missing?
Oh that has a very simple answer - I copy-pasted incorrectly, it is supposed to be range 1.
Got it! Thanks for the response!
Does Armor stack?
Iron form has different rules for iron token. It says you can reduce movement by 1 per token, and doesn't state the 2 token limit per hit.
Some actions do not specify "With in range" such as Irons Contain Pulling choice and Rally's group up. These actions almost imply that they would effect targets you can see, as Rally doesnt work well without control and Iron can't pull unless it has greater than range one. However under Target rules it states "Targets must be within Range, unless stated otherwise."
Armor does not stack, you either have it or you do not.
Iron Tokens reduce both damage and forced movement, and they have the 2 token limit per hit. If the reminder text under Iron Form differs from that, use these values instead, and I'll fix it in the patch notes.
That is an oversight, both of those examples should be "you can see"
If you use an ability like Shockwave and multiple Stooges are in range, they only take damage once, correct? Since they're one foe?
No, Stooges are exceptionally vulnerable to area attacks. Each Stooge is a valid target, so if you hit 3 with a shockwave, they lose 3 HP from their shared health bar.
Dropping the Google Sheets-based character sheet I've been using for play.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Gi9W5akg_14MGLne_LIWg2KVeO8keRvxMuVfWQ7l...
I pair it with Roll20 or another 'simple' VTT to handle maps, tokens, and HP, but this is really useful for character-building, especially for NPCs.
Edit: Now with tutorial tab.
ayo, just came across this thanks to the sugarpunch video. can't wait to buy it but in the mean time I've been working on a TTS mod for me and my friends to play. I really hope this game blows up!!!
This is EXTREMELY cool, I'm a big fan of putting stances and abilities onto cards.
Justice as Blaster is amazing.
Looking forward to this! Keep us posted!
Are you planning on putting this anywhere to share it? This looks REALLY good.
I've been making very slow progress because im busy with some life stuff but i'll see if I can put it on the steam workshop when im done :)
NOTE: There is an errata coming soon, with updates to a lot of the game as well as Advancement Rules. These patch notes will be available for free.
The Advancement Rules can be found here, for now: https://pastebin.com/RtT2mNdQ
Part of me is curious about Focused Phantom or the Teacher Elder style. Do they still have access to all of the other stances when there are more than three stances? (I admit I am foolishly trying to prepare the character sheets I am building for Foundry for material that is still in development. I take full responsibility for this hubris)
Yes, as you gain more Unique Actions, the Phantom abilities and the Elder ability gain more options.
Please join the 6FU discord so I can give you your due kudos!!
hello there, just like everyone else I came from SugerPunch video. I gonna get the game soon but I have a question. I know from other reviews there isn't a character advancement per say. but is there any way I could hack some kind advancement system into the game?
If you scroll down a bit, there is a post from liberigothica that includes an image that has a preliminary advancement system in the works. The message is from a year ago so you might have to scroll for a little bit.
I've made a pastebin for the Advancement rules: https://pastebin.com/RtT2mNdQ
This will be in a patch notes update, coming soon for free to everyone who already has the game.
I had a question concerning frantic wardancer with the wild style. I have thought of a few ways that wild style using two forms might work, but I wanted confirmation (and if it is something else entirely, please let me know).
1. You still only pick three forms at character creation, but when you use wild style, you use two of them.
2. You pick four forms at character creation, but two of them are paired and always used with wild style.
3. You pick four forms at character creation, and you can chose any two when you are using wild style.
The version in the book uses option 1, but I do have that in the upcoming errata as:
When you pick Forbidden Style on a Frantic character, choose one Form. That Form is always attached to Forbidden Style, along with a second Form chosen when you make your stance during your turn.
Thank you! I am working on building a functional character sheet in Foundry for some friends and I to use for online sessions (drop down menus for selecting things, fields auto populating with relevent info, etc). I am being meticulous and trying to include all of the niche cases like Phantom and Forbidden style.
I hope to be able to share the sheets on Foundry once I am done for others to use.
Absolutely, share them far and wide! Anything to help folks play is great in my book.
I’m looking out for it dude, I can’t wait to use it!
This is an awesome game, but one infinite I spotted was Frantic Phantom, One-Two maybe Blaster form, Brawling Style, and Flamethrower from Incinerator. Only works if they're against a wall, but still. Would appreciate if it was in the Errata.
Thank you for letting me know! This is the second (possibly third) infinite that's been found with Frantic Phantom, actually, so I already had an errata for it:
Once during this turn, you can use any Unique Action you know, from among all your Styles and Forms. You must still pay its Cost.
Your Unique Actions have their cost reduced by 1 (to a minimum of 1+ or 2 tokens) during this turn.
As so many have said before me: This game is incredible! As a Magic player, I get the same feeling I get from deck building, as a TTRPG! Hosting games soon =)
To add to the Infinite topic: Fused Phantom + Elder Style + Song Form can Sing Along to give itself a 4 Action Die, and loop the song for infinite Basic Tokens for themselves and their team.
Just like in MtG, cost reductions can be abused, haha!
Hi, this game looks awesome (discovered via Sugarpunch video)! Do you intend to release an errata-ed/updated version? If I buy the game now, and there's an update in the future, do I get the update for free or do I have to buy again the updated version?
From the dev's Twitter, the errata document will most likely be available for free.
https://x.com/Veliministriari/status/1798774627264761959
Thanks!
Hi, I was wondering if there was a discord or forum or something to ask questions about the system. A friend and I tried a quick sample fight, and his character was using the Focused Phantom Archetype. With it he had a Vortex Power stance and a Puppet Control stance, and it seems like you can, on turn 1, simply set up a Black Hole and instantly ring out someone by using Pull the Strings to move them into the "Edge" created by Black Hole. Is this correct or does the opponent get a turn to be allowed to use Speed tokens to get out of the Black Hole?
In a 1v1 scenario, I'd give both sides the Big Boss Comeback rule, regardless of whether they're actual Bosses or players, in which case they are removed from play temporarily, but not Taken Out.
In a 2v2 scenario and above, the target is immediately dunked into the Edge and Taken Out, but their allies may Rescue them to get them out on the following player turn, benefit from Heroic Spirit so their turn isn't wasted, etc.
I haven't played much with Edge-based styles, so I can't tell you more.
are there gm-less or solo rules, or how does the game present that setup?
No, the rules are incredibly light on the roleplaying side; so it would be relatively easy to run solod brawler matches, though you'd need to create a deck or tactical rules for the goons you brawl against. Elsewise it'll feel like you're playing training mode in a tournament fighter.
Saw the youtuber SugarPunch talk about this, and half way in I was sold.
This system just seemed way to perfect to not get, i'll be running it before too long with friends of mine.
Also came here due to that video
when the mechanics speak for themselves that well how can you not?
Yeah, I was thinking this sounds fun.
Then he ran the fight, and I was like "Well, I am buying this right now!"
just order it on DriveThruRPG because I want the fisical copy
Exact same reason, even went and grabbed the hard cover with the PDF. Can't wait for it to arrive and sink my teeth into it.
Given the games general lack of artwork I went for a paperback, hope you're getting fun out of it - my houserule: for Combat - Have a 'turn zero' where in initiative order players add their characters to the grid and choose an opening stance. I think of it like the opening footsies in capcom fighters where players can move but not attack during "ROUND...1..."
Same here, his demonstration of the mechanics did a lot to sell me on it. I'll definitely be grabbing a physical copy.
Same, went to DTRPG to get a paperback physical alongside the PDF - only $4 more (and shipping) that way.
Also came here thanks to SugarPunch video. ^^
is there an italian translation by anybody? 😅 Anyway: i have the physical book and i thank you for it.
Sorry, there are no translations available of Panic at the Dojo
thanks anyway! (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ*:･ﾟ✧💖🍀
Yo! Glad to see the game getting more attention (and looking forwards to the errata pass!).
Our group had a couple of assorted rule questions and comments after play- we made spot calls as needed, but we wanted to raise them as concerns/questions for errata;
1. Question about whether 0 damage counts as damage (answered below).
2. Can you spend any number of iron tokens on one hit (suggested by Armored Style, page 69), or just 1-2 (Glossary, page 280)?
3. How does 'priority' work? If someone wants to take an action during someone else's turn (ex. a token action), can they take as many token actions as they like before that person can take a Simple Action or use Free Movement? Can the person who's turn it is interrupt with their own token action? We generally settled on 'one side has a chance to take an action, then the other side has a chance to take an action'.
4. If a Copy moves into a space with an obstacle (particularly a Trap) using movement, what happens? Do they just coexist?
5. How do actions with an X in their cost interact with cost reduction (Elder, Phantom)? Can we treat them as a 'tiered action' with effectively infinite tiers (one for each possible die roll? Edit: Looked at Waiting Game- I'm going to guess they aren't affected by cost reduction, lol
6. This is a really goofy edge case, but a player actually did this- if someone takes Forbidden Power/Iron can they just not move? Is it split 50%/25%/25%? Our GM ruled that every 2 Speed Tokens effectively generated 1 Power and 1 Iron and 1 Speed (they were quite strong in combat, but it felt pretty fair overall- we had a strong party)
7. Play feedback- Necromancer making copies anywhere in line of sight felt like it could have very easily been overwhelming in combination with a mobile foe due to giving it effectively infinite range- the damage was low impact compared to the ability of the Boss to summon a copy at the start of their turn and then menace us at long range 'for free'. This might be working as intended, but it doesn't feel like the horde playstyle suggested by Necromancer.
8. When a character has a Copy take an action, my understanding is that this means 'you are taking the action, but from the position of the Copy', e.g. the player could, for example, spend Power tokens on behalf of the Copy, or discard their Challenge token if the Copy's action dealt damage to your Challenge target- is this correct?
9. Can you hit a single Mook foe multiple times with stuff like a 3+ Shockwave or Whirlwind if they have multiple bodes in range?
10. Play feedback- Challenge tokens are crazy impactful, and can virtually shut down Song Warriors, which may be completely unable to break through defensive walls or even get in range quickly. Fun, but felt on the edge of being an OP mechanic, with certain builds and situations making it nearly impossible to take any action- when everyone's challenged by one Bring It On!, nobody can even Put It Out! to clear a challenge.
Hello! Picked up Panic at the Dojo after hearing about it via, of course, OSP. Glad to have found your work.
It seems right up my alley, and well-designed: lots of opportunity for interesting decisionmaking in fights and while building a character; and a clean and clear approach to framing those fights. Almost feels like a board game, especially with how symmetrically fights are designed. Several of my friends are also interested, so I may actually get to run the game!
So, caveat that I've read through but not played it yet, I have some questions of intent/clarification:
1. Song Form's details says that you are always your own ally; does this hold everywhere? e.g. can a Teacher can use Inspired tokens and '3+: Watch Closely' on themselves?
2. When Phantom or Elder Style reduces the cost of an action, does that include reducing the cost of gates beyond the first (e.g. would Sing Along be reduced from '1+ or 4+ or 6+' to '1+ or 3+ or 5+'?
3. When you Sing Along without being in Song Form (e.g. via Focused Phantom or Elder Style), you don't have a song token type selected. Is the intent that you simply can't pick the 'gain 2 tokens' mode, or something else?
4. Are Chaos tokens intended to be usable for any action (i.e. as an action pool '4'), or specifically for actions with a cost or gate of exactly '4+' (and no lower)?
5. If something like a Chaos token ("used exclusively by the X") is stolen (e.g. via Syphon Style's '2+ or 6+: Power Converter'), can the recipient use it for its native function?
6. Can a Teacher use multiple Inspired tokens in the same turn?
There's also a few things I've spotted that may be infinite loops; either I've misread something, or they would be good targets for errata:
- Fused or Frantic Phantom + Song Form + Elder Style
If Phantom and Elder Style's cost reductions stack, that would mean the free 4 action from Sing Along would be enough to meet the 6+ gate of another Sing Along, repeating the process and accumulating resources.
- Chaos token + Motivating Style's '4+ You Can Do It!'
If you copy a chaos token, you can use You Can Do It again by expending that chaos token, healing/moving/etc. as you repeat the process. If you can't target yourself, this can still be done with two characters that are fused Demon/Teachers. Inspired tokens could work similarly, but are less egregious since it isn't guaranteed.
- Frantic Phantom + Blaster Form + Vampire Style, using Flare
Distracting Style's '1+ or 2 basic tokens: Flare' can give two enemies a weakness token while using Blaster Form; if you're also using Vampire Style, that would give you two power tokens if I'm reading correctly, which can repeat the process to give those enemies an unlimited number of weakness tokens.
I do really love this system, already; that's why I'm engaging with it so much. Thank you for making it :)
While not an infinite exactly, Brawling Zen is tremendously difficult to take down except by specific approaches.
When your shield is broken by damage from a foe, you gain one Power token from Brawling, then Zen deals 1 damage back to them. If you don't spend Power tokens on this hit, you gain a second Power token, meaning you can immediately put up a new shield with Tough It Out, arguably before the next damage action comes in.
Traps, Crush, and Armor/Iron tokens can counter this to some extent, but it's pretty difficult to break otherwise.
With a bit of setup (an ally with Dance, the Found an Opening bonus, or access to Chaos tokens), a Frantic Phantom with access to Patient style can gain access to Waiting Game outside their turn without being restricted by Patient's 'one action per turn' limit, letting them take it an unlimited number of times before cashing it out as one big infinite-power action (useful for, ex. Movement to generate infinite Speed for some sort of token action).
Edit: Missed that shield damage does overflow to HP! Whoops!
You can only have one shield active per turn, a new one will not become active until the end of turn.
From Brawling Form:
Brawling Zen can rebuild its Shields as they break. While inactive Shields don't normally become active until the end of the turn, you can use Tough It Out after your active Shield breaks to immediately have a new active Shield.
So, asking for clarification, does the 'default bonus' mean that everyone in the team gets +2 max HP, and this can be replaced with only one person getting one of the other bonuses?
that is correct.
Working on an errata document + a progression system free bonus PDF, but until I get that done, here is the basic progression system:
I like it! Reads as sensible and appropriately simple and elegant.
First things that jump to mind:
Focused Phantoms get a *lot* of options when they get a fused archetype; including Waiting Game, which breaks when you can get it without the restrictions imposed by Patient Style, Elder Style, or Frantic Phantom.
Focused or Frantic Phantoms will generally scale extremely well with extra stances.
Frantic heroes' expanding combinatorial versatility is offset by not getting as many archetype abilities at once, which I find very elegant.
A lot of potent combos using the extra archetype (e.g. Focused Punk + Fused Winterblossom) are things that a cooperating party would already be able to do, which helps control the scope of things.
Looks good!
Does 0 damage count as damage? One-Two saying you can use it to clear 6 Weakness tokens suggests yes, but Knockdown Style suggests that reducing damage to 0 with Armor and Iron means it doesn't count as damage.
0 damage does not count as "damage," no. One-Two is going to have a written in exception in the errata I am working on, something like: "When you deal damage to an enemy with an Action, hit them again for 1 more damage. Even if the initial damage is reduced to zero by Armor, Iron tokens, or Weakness tokens, you still get this extra 1-damage hit."
Thank you!
I know this is an old one, but might it be best to word One-Two's ability differently just to avoid confusion?
Something like "Each time you hit an enemy with an Action that deals damage, hit them again for 1 damage?"
Not sure if that fixes it exactly, but figured I'd share my idea.
In the upcoming patch, One-Two's Ability will read:
After each damage-dealing Action you perform, you may deal 1 damage to each target of that Action.
So would this intentionally no longer synergize with say Rushdown from Relentless Style?
Yeah, it only adds one more hit to the total, instead of giving a second hit for each hit.
My play group is starting to get into the game, and there is a weird rule I cant wrap my brain around. If you are Taken out, do you still get to change stances when it comes time for your heroic spirit turn? It seems weird that you could swap into bleeding/ Zombie and just negate threat by damage that way.
Even more so when something like Angel/ Cavalry doesn't have access to that .
Is there some kind of vulnerability I am not seeing here?
Yes, you do get to change stances (second paragraph, page 31). Of note is that the Vigilance stance heals itself at the start of its turn, meaning that all archetypes can spec into the ability to stand themself back up.
A special note for Angel- as mentioned on page 61, the Angel Ability lets them get back up even when damaged, since it heals them.
The primary counter, as I see it, is to avoid focusing damage on foes who will just regenerate off your damage, or by 'wasting' their healing by only dealing small amounts of damage to them - you win by getting everyone to 0 HP, in whichever order that involves.
I ran a session today, and I had a lot of trouble with Stooges- mainly, how start-of-turn effects work with them, and how tokens are shared- I had a group of Zombies and a The Light (angel/song warrior); I couldn't tell whether the Zombies each generated Iron tokens from their build, gained one token for one of them, etc. A similar question came up for The Light's start-of-turn ability to grant tokens to all allies at once.
Stooges hold tokens as a single unit. An effect that gives 1 Iron token to all allies would only give one Iron token to each separate group of Zombies. They have just the one token pile and any Zombie in the unit may spend tokens from that pile.